Thread by @mimmymum, Lots of controversy being stirred up about this interview between @OwenJones84 & [...]

Lots of controversy being stirred up about this interview between @OwenJones84 & @piersmorgan - especially as it focuses heavily on trans issues.

The biggest question is: Should Owen as a trans ally be platforming someone considered a transphobe?

Some thoughts...

(Thread)... https://twitter.com/owenjones84/status/1330957906167132164

https://twitter.com/owenjones84/status/1330957906167132164

The argument of some is that @OwenJones84 shouldn’t have given @piersmorgan a platform because:
- Piers is considered a transphobe
- Piers already has a huge platform
- In giving Piers a platform, it further promotes transphobic views
- Trans people’s rights aren’t a debate...

There is also the issue that @OwenJones84 and @piersmorgan are both privileged cis males with big platforms, talking extensively about predominantly marginalised trans women with no public voice...

That said, the comment / question to the trans community and trans allies is: Trans issues have been dragged into the public discourse in a negative way - it is not going away, and is getting worse. If allies like @OwenJones84 don’t talk about it, only the negative is heard...

Yes, @OwenJones84 can avoid platforming negative trans talking points, but by ignoring them, it doesn’t stop the media and people like @piersmorgan talking about them, and the public from getting sucked in by them if they don’t hear a counter argument.

I know. It’s exhausting...

That’s the catch 22: Have a “debate” about trans issues (which is dehumanising / exhausting) or refuse to debate (allowing trans-hostile rhetoric to go unchallenged and further take grip)

There’s no simple answer...

At the moment there’s a situation of extremist transphobes systematically undermining trans rights on one side, and exhausted, embattled trans people not wanting to keep defending their rights on the other.

The thing is, the majority of the public are in the middle...

How do trans people make their views heard by the majority in the middle, if they don’t engage?

One solution is for trans allies like @OwenJones84 to engage on their behalf.

This then raises questions about centring trans voices in discussions about trans issues...

Maybe @OwenJones84 could have brought a trans person into the discussion with @piersmorgan? But surely that would put a trans person in a position of “debating” their life - which defeats the objective of trying to protect them from having to do that?..

Maybe @OwenJones84 could use his platform to elevate trans voices in a way that doesn’t put them in opposition to trans-hostile ones? Yet he’s already doing that, and continues to do so...

Maybe @OwenJones84 should just not have invited @piersmorgan onto his platform?

But what needs to be remembered, is that Piers has a larger ‘following’ that Owen - many of which are the ‘general public’ who currently only hear trans-hostile views in the media...

In inviting @piersmorgan onto his show, @OwenJones84 creates an opportunity for Piers ‘followers’ to hear Owen presenting trans-supportive views, and for him to debunk some of Piers rhetoric away from the confrontational Piers-centric platform of GMB...

If the objective is to ‘win over’ the majority of the public to trans-supportive views, surely the most effective way of doing that is to have access to large platforms? @piersmorgan has a large platform. @OwenJones84 has been able to reach them by inviting Piers on his show...

Yes, @OwenJones84 could have invited a trans-supportive megastar with a huge platform like @ladygaga to talk about trans issues - but her followers are likely trans-supportive anyway.

If the objective is to win support to trans issues, you need to talk to non-supporters

...

But where to draw the line of who the trans community should ‘consort’ with?

The ‘gender critical’ transphobes have been rightly criticised for aligning and collaborating with extremist anti-abortion/ anti-LGBT / alt right / Christian fundamentalist / hate groups...

If the trans community insist on some sort of ‘purity test’ and only consort with trans-supportive people, or those who align

with us, then we’ll end up in a very small echo chamber.

It’s only by reaching out to those who don’t agree with us, that we make an impact...

But how far do we reach out to talk to, or give a platform to those who hold different beliefs?

I guess each individual person needs to decide for themselves what sits right with them?

Everyone’s core beliefs are different, and no one person represents a whole community...

Individual and collective beliefs and standards also shift over time. As both @OwenJones84 and @piersmorgan acknowledged - Both Piers personal stance on what is considered homophobic, as well as the British public’s as a whole, has changed over the last 20 years...

I would hope that in 20 years time, that the way trans people are talked about in the UK media would be regarded with the same disgust as the homophobia of the 1980’s media is now.

This can only happen through conversation and education...

I don’t have any definitive answers to the questions I raise above (I don’t think there are any absolute ‘right’ answers?)

I also recognise that I write this as a cis woman, which gives me a privilege (and lack of perspective) compared to trans people...

As always, I’m open to learning, taking on other’s opinions and acknowledging if I’ve done something wrong.

I think that’s probably the most important thing we can do - is give people space to learn, grow, be wrong, apologise, and move on towards (hopefully) trans inclusivity

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