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Alright, finally in a position where I can write.
So it sounds like the new Ento-L will be managed by @blayjorge, who by all means sounds like a decent guy (I don& #39;t know him well).
I don& #39;t necessarily want to put him on blast, but did want to share my experiences w/TEG. https://twitter.com/Cataranea/status/1321108640586223619">https://twitter.com/Cataranea...
So it sounds like the new Ento-L will be managed by @blayjorge, who by all means sounds like a decent guy (I don& #39;t know him well).
I don& #39;t necessarily want to put him on blast, but did want to share my experiences w/TEG. https://twitter.com/Cataranea/status/1321108640586223619">https://twitter.com/Cataranea...
I& #39;m also doing this, because the little logic bois are sliding into DMs to tell people that science isn& #39;t political.
Which, I mean...
*gestures wildly at the American dumpster fire* https://twitter.com/SaveWildBees/status/1320909210218016769?s=20">https://twitter.com/SaveWildB...
Which, I mean...
*gestures wildly at the American dumpster fire* https://twitter.com/SaveWildBees/status/1320909210218016769?s=20">https://twitter.com/SaveWildB...
So, anyways.
Any time you start a project where groups of people talk to each other, there will be conflict which you have to resolve.
Resolving these conflicts is inherently political. Always, and without exception.
Any time you start a project where groups of people talk to each other, there will be conflict which you have to resolve.
Resolving these conflicts is inherently political. Always, and without exception.
Having an entomologist listserv is great, but unfortunately, the last one was a dumpster fire and got a reputation as being the Mos Eisley of the scientific community.
So, because of that-we& #39;ll just say storied-history, I have 6 questions I& #39;d like to see addressed.
So, because of that-we& #39;ll just say storied-history, I have 6 questions I& #39;d like to see addressed.
1.) What are the rules?
Any online community needs an explicit set of rules. Even just having them posted tells people what the expectations of the community are, and what to expect.
General guidelines won& #39;t work; you need enforceable statements.
Any online community needs an explicit set of rules. Even just having them posted tells people what the expectations of the community are, and what to expect.
General guidelines won& #39;t work; you need enforceable statements.
2.) How were these rules decided?
Rules can& #39;t be random, they need specific reasons for being there.
One example of a rule in TEG is that we don& #39;t allow for medical advice or treatment advice...because bad pest control/medical advice kills people.
Rules can& #39;t be random, they need specific reasons for being there.
One example of a rule in TEG is that we don& #39;t allow for medical advice or treatment advice...because bad pest control/medical advice kills people.
3.) How will these rules be enforced, and by who?
The problem with Ento-L was that it was "community enforcement" which really just means that they allowed harassers to run dissenters out of the community.
Clear guidelines for enforcement, and diverse mods are needed.
The problem with Ento-L was that it was "community enforcement" which really just means that they allowed harassers to run dissenters out of the community.
Clear guidelines for enforcement, and diverse mods are needed.
4.) Will these rules extend to off-forum behavior?
One of the prominent-I dare say the Lord Voldemort of the group-was famous for stalking, threatening, and generally harassing EVERYONE in the entomocommunity.
Will people like AD be welcome?
One of the prominent-I dare say the Lord Voldemort of the group-was famous for stalking, threatening, and generally harassing EVERYONE in the entomocommunity.
Will people like AD be welcome?
5.) What are the criteria for removing someone from the ListServ?
Two people having a civil disagreement is one thing, and that& #39;s going to happen...but if someone& #39;s sending dirty DMs to someone else off-forum, will they be kicked?
(Yes, this will happen eventually. I promise)
Two people having a civil disagreement is one thing, and that& #39;s going to happen...but if someone& #39;s sending dirty DMs to someone else off-forum, will they be kicked?
(Yes, this will happen eventually. I promise)
5.) Cont& #39;d
If two people are having a heated disagreement, where do you draw the line and how?
Scientists get into some really fucking weird arguments, and there needs to be at least some room for discussions.
If two people are having a heated disagreement, where do you draw the line and how?
Scientists get into some really fucking weird arguments, and there needs to be at least some room for discussions.
6.) What is the antiharassment policy?
I mean, self-explanatory, right?
I guess a good set of rules-one that Ento-L lacked (because AD& #39;s there, that& #39;s your first clue)-is always an antiharassment policy in some way, shape or form...
I mean, self-explanatory, right?
I guess a good set of rules-one that Ento-L lacked (because AD& #39;s there, that& #39;s your first clue)-is always an antiharassment policy in some way, shape or form...
...but the main issue with the last Ento-L community was that the harassers were literally running the show, and I feel like for this community to fully embrace the new version (which, it& #39;s not hard to improve it), there will need to be an explicitly spelled out AH policy.
Now, I know this is pretty intense for a simple listserv but the problems with the last one really speak to the need for this one to be held to a high standard.
I heard that this one& #39;s purpose will be to "stick to bugs", but what does that even mean?
I heard that this one& #39;s purpose will be to "stick to bugs", but what does that even mean?
Here are some sample common questions/subjects from TEG which intersect with politics:
Asking for career advice/job market stuff?
Well, prepare for people to start talking about academia vs industry vs govt and all the complexities there.
It& #39;s political.
Asking for career advice/job market stuff?
Well, prepare for people to start talking about academia vs industry vs govt and all the complexities there.
It& #39;s political.
Anything involving bees/insect declines?
Get prepared for a long, drawn out, and potentially fractious debate on US agricultural policy.
Get prepared for a long, drawn out, and potentially fractious debate on US agricultural policy.
What& #39;s the funding outlook for the next decade?
Perfectly valid question for a listserv, and because it touches on policy, it& #39;s political by definition.
Perfectly valid question for a listserv, and because it touches on policy, it& #39;s political by definition.
Finally:
How did your Uni/company/lab handle COVID?
It is not enough to be pro-science. You must also be pro-scientist, and give your audience a forum in which to converse about the things which affect them.
Don& #39;t like it? Sorry, neither will your users....
How did your Uni/company/lab handle COVID?
It is not enough to be pro-science. You must also be pro-scientist, and give your audience a forum in which to converse about the things which affect them.
Don& #39;t like it? Sorry, neither will your users....
...and those conversations will always get started sooner or later because people go to these projects looking to connect with colleagues.
I guess, to end, my final question would be what would a "only talk about bugs" forum even LOOK LIKE?
Because this topic encompasses so much, and people bond over this stuff so easily, and get so passionate, that this statement is nonspecific at best.
Because this topic encompasses so much, and people bond over this stuff so easily, and get so passionate, that this statement is nonspecific at best.
