I should make like a chart or long ass thread comparing dudebros and proshippers because tbh at some point these groups are just gonna have to acknowledge eachother's presence

it's hard to do because a lot of dudebros are both obnoxious as fuck and often take their beliefs from

what i can only call "imageboard culture" like using f*g or t*rd a lot, whether it be on its own or as a suffix, being very troll-like in nature (spamming images, "are you TRIGGERED?", etc) and often bizarrely holding tradcon beliefs with the sole exception being their opinion

on fetish cartoons, which (rightfully so) makes proshippers despise them and kick them out of their spaces but they keep coming back because they literally aren't aware that proshippers are any different from them, let alone that theyre being classified as dudebros

what i mean by this is that every once in a while ill see a proshipper make a tweet specifically telling dudebros to gtfo of proship spaces, and the dudebro response is usually something along the lines of this image:

dudebros dont understand proshippers saying "dudebros leave" because not only do they not know that proshippers think of them as dudebros, but they also aren't even aware that there's more than one group that's "pro-fiction", as in they dont even know that

proshippers (the leftist kind) exist, and this problem is only compounded by the fact many dudebros have that "anti-sjw" attitude still that makes them believe that there's no WAY a proshipper could exist.

I can't really explain what made the older, more first-generation, like

fresh off of an imageboard type ones develop into "dudebros" as proshippers call them, but I think for the "newer generation" this is due to how they seem to come into existence(? probably not the best term for it), which also kind of explains why they all act so insufferable.

If I had to guess, a lot of these newer dudebro "origin" stories probably play out like this:

They start the anime/manga hobby being politically neutral or only carrying what political beliefs they had before getting into fandom

They eventually stumble across discourse, however

it's literally ALWAYS some anti-kink nut spouting SWERF shit

They look for similar viewpoints, and since dudebros are significantly larger than proshippers as a group, they'll come across dudebros first, and more often

What I think is happening is theyll see these

right-wing (except for hentai) "anti-sjw" dudebros and the anti-kink SWERFs and then try to associate these two groups with entire political parties, and THEN associate each party with good and bad

They see dudebros as representative of "right wing" and then see "right wing" as

"good" which in turn causes them to start acting in that manner; being troll-like, using imageboard lingo, like excessive use of f*g and t*rd, especially as suffixes

theyll even adopt some tradcon beliefs, which bizarrely enough can sometimes be something misogynistic, but they

can write it off as not hypocritical to their pro-fiction attitude because theyve already convinced themselves the right is pro-cartoon weirdshit

conversely, they see whatever few SWERFs they engaged with as being representative of the left, and then classify the left as "bad"

because they now think that the left is inherently anti-kink

this is kind of a problem for proshippers regardless of how they handle dudebros; telling them to fuck off doesnt work because dudebros dont even know that proshippers are a group, let alone "dudebro" refers to them

and keeping them around (at least in their current state) is bad because no one wants to be associated with a bunch of trolls that don't actually argue but instead only spam shit at people and often hold other stupid tradcon beliefs that proshippers hate and understandably don't

want to be associated with

i bring this up because IMO the "best" solution would be to somehow deradicalize dudebros and make them realize they've picked the wrong allies, because some of them were starting to wake up even if only for short periods of time

when vwitney bentee

went on her rampage against vtubers, a lot of dudebros kinda realized that their idea of "the right is pro-hentai" is flawed when their favorite traditionalist ecelebs crawled out of the woodwork to defend/support her

sadly this didn't make them realize their LARPing was for

nothing and their current perceived tradcon allies will target their fetish cartoons sooner or later, but my point still stands

also, dudebros are just a larger group, as well as proshippers dont really have much of a presence in consumerist fandom which IMO is an issue

ok im done with this thread, it's not even coherent or planned and ill make a better one at a later date that elaborates on the "why" when it comes to needing these two groups to eventually acknowledge eachother one way or the other