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How To counter LGBT liberals THREAD:
Before we even continue with this potential thread, we should address that we should have basic understanding of subjective and objective morality, have valid arguments and NOT use "God said so" as an argument as it leads to Circular reasoning
Before we even continue with this potential thread, we should address that we should have basic understanding of subjective and objective morality, have valid arguments and NOT use "God said so" as an argument as it leads to Circular reasoning
1. We should always start with a specific Topic when discussing with LGBT supporters. It's best to understand where each person involved is coming from before we can continue with this discussion/debate. I prefer asking "Why is LGBT okay?" to understand their reasoning.
The response I usually get back from them is "Love is love" or "No one is being harmed", while some go to the extreme of using labels straight away such as "You're homophobic!". This is an intellectually weak response from them.
You should avoid addressing that you're NOT homophobic, as Men on Men and Women on Women is haram and you're going off-topic from the discussion. You can also respond with "You're Islamophobic!" as they clearly don't understand the definition of Homophobia or ignore and continue.
2. After they provide their reason to justify why LGBT is okay, you have 2 options:
1) Address their reason
2) Give your reason why LGBT is wrong and immoral.
1) Address their reason
2) Give your reason why LGBT is wrong and immoral.
I usually like to give my reason as to why it's wrong, and then provide a logical explanation (Not just Qur'an evidence) to show them that it's wrong.
These are some points I use:
1) If LGBT is okay, why not Incest?
2) If we were all Gay we'd cease to exist
3) STDs occur
4) Physical harm (To Anus) and Unstable mentality
5) Corruption to Minors through social influence
You can then say "It's also a commandment from Allah SWT".
1) If LGBT is okay, why not Incest?
2) If we were all Gay we'd cease to exist
3) STDs occur
4) Physical harm (To Anus) and Unstable mentality
5) Corruption to Minors through social influence
You can then say "It's also a commandment from Allah SWT".
They may respond "Incest is immoral" (Assuming most LGBT are atheists), you can then respond "That's your opinion and it's subjective as others may disagree". They may also bring up Deformed babies and there are some counters to such an argument which you can use against them.
Here are some:
1) Even non-relatives couples could have deformed babies, especially if one has a disability.
2) Brother and Brother can't reproduce so your argument falls apart.
3) Brother and Sister can use protection to prevent pregnancy.
1) Even non-relatives couples could have deformed babies, especially if one has a disability.
2) Brother and Brother can't reproduce so your argument falls apart.
3) Brother and Sister can use protection to prevent pregnancy.
They may then respond "Protection may not always work" for option 3, and that's where you could use some of these comebacks:
1) A sister who has entered Menopause (Can not produce)
2) There are many birth control methods such as vasectomy, pills, condoms & Anal/Oral
1) A sister who has entered Menopause (Can not produce)
2) There are many birth control methods such as vasectomy, pills, condoms & Anal/Oral
They won't be able to justify why Anal or Oral are wrong because their whole belief is based upon giving anal and oral. Not just that, but Menopause permanently prevents pregnancy.
They may continue or mention family problems or powers, so respond with 'Twins' or same can be said with LGBT individuals coming out to their family or families not accepting specific races or religions.
3. Moving onto the next point of STDs. They may mention protection etc will protect them, just respond "There is always the chance of the condom breaking and the butt is a dirty location with feces which can lead to irritation to the sexual organ." Not hard to counter.
4. Next point of physical harm to anus. They may mention the use of Lube to make it easier to enter the Anus, but that doesn't negate the feces which I addressed before and it actually increases the chance of condoms breaking. There can also be the chance of organ tearing.
5. Corruption to minors is the most impacting one out of them all. I remember before LGBT was even legalised, you wouldn't see gay kids but now you're seeing 13 and under coming out as gay and experimenting with same sex. Not just that, but teachers are now told to teach LGBT.
Sex education was the only thing I was taught at 11, but now LGBT is being normalised and taught to little kids and now they're believing LGBT is okay.
They may say it's okay to be gay and 'Love is Love' but at the end of the day, there are kids overthinking and questioning their sexuality, losing their identity [Transforming], loving idols and objects, yet Incest is seen as bad for some reason? LGBT is inconsistent.
There are children being adopted by LGBT, when this links with my point about ceasing to exist and socially influenced, they're now teaching those adopted children that gay is okay in a closed environment. People losing their identity and seeing themselves as 'HE/SHE/THEY/IT'
I actually forgot 1 point:
6) Too much privilege leads to transgressing. LGBT was seen as wrong years ago and now it's "normal" in today's world. In the next 10 years, incest or killing may be seen as morally okay and become normalised.
6) Too much privilege leads to transgressing. LGBT was seen as wrong years ago and now it's "normal" in today's world. In the next 10 years, incest or killing may be seen as morally okay and become normalised.
Though some individuals may say "As long as I'm not being hurt, it's fine". If that's the case, why can't I rape, kill or have incest? I'm not getting hurt and I don't care for others, so it's not my problem. This is the mentality that LGBT apologists have.
They may say "Someone is being hurt" so respond:
1) You are getting hurt during Anal and/or you're being physically and mentally harmed
2) Why do you care? Justify why those things are wrong but LGBT isn't.
1) You are getting hurt during Anal and/or you're being physically and mentally harmed
2) Why do you care? Justify why those things are wrong but LGBT isn't.
You could even go to the extreme of adding child/adult relations, let me explain:
1) Anal penetration is morally wrong and cause physical damage to the Anus. Children [Girls during sex/Boys during anal] are also being physically damaged to their respective organs.
1) Anal penetration is morally wrong and cause physical damage to the Anus. Children [Girls during sex/Boys during anal] are also being physically damaged to their respective organs.
So why is it okay for only LGBT to have intercourse but not child/adult? If they bring in age of consent, then simply respond with Marriage law of respective country. In the UK, a girl 16 can marry whoever she wants above 50 etc with parental consent.
And if we use their 'liberalism' against them, we can say (if they disagree) "That you're taking away the rights of an individual who wants to get married. If both give consent, then it's none of your business to interfere".
They again may use "That man is a pedophile if he wants to marry that 16yr old". Let's look at the definition of pedophilia for a second. It's not pedophilia, as it's exclusive attraction to 'Prepubescent individuals'. Age has nothing to do with being a pedophile or not.
We can even use this point to justify why Prophet Muhammad SAW marriage to our Mother Aisha RA was completely Okay:
He married her at 6 BUT never had sexual intentions till she reached 9 which is when she reached Puberty, so their argument becomes invalid.
He married her at 6 BUT never had sexual intentions till she reached 9 which is when she reached Puberty, so their argument becomes invalid.
Not to mention that there were no laws which put a number on the age of sexual intercourse which doesn't work considering all countries have different age of consent. Islam comes with a universal age of consent which is Puberty and Mentally ready.
If they call you a pedophile or insult after explaining your point, you can either:
1) End the debate
2) Ask them to define pedophilia again
3) Why are they questioning Mother Aisha RA when she narrated Al-Hadith?
4) Ask when a person should have sex
5) Say 'subjective belief'.
1) End the debate
2) Ask them to define pedophilia again
3) Why are they questioning Mother Aisha RA when she narrated Al-Hadith?
4) Ask when a person should have sex
5) Say 'subjective belief'.
For point 4, if they say an age then just state another country which has a different age of consent and justify that a 25 year old man and 18 year old girl going to hong kong to do anal is illegal and pedophilia based on their definition of pedophilia and age of consent is 21.
Not to mention the age of consent in Japan is 13, so are they really going to complain when a 13 year old girl hooks up with an 18 year old which they've both given consent to? They have no rights to intervene because 'They're taking away their rights' ~ Liberalism 2020.
If I have anything else to add, I'll add onto this thread.
