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Okay NEW thread to talk about shows I love that pass/fail the male lead or leader character. As a personal rule, the Cis/Het male MC should be the most traumatized by the end of the series. Doesn't have to be at the start, but I relate on a rising scale of trauma 
https://twitter.com/AdamMCGames/status/1294092810895974400
https://twitter.com/AdamMCGames/status/1294092810895974400
Star Trek Enterprise. I love Captain Archer. He's the best captain. The Kirk/Picard debate is irrelevant (and excludes Sisko from DS9 for some reason? And Janeway never gets any airtime either) :/
Anyway he passes (and so does Picard, but I'm an Enterprise kid)
Anyway he passes (and so does Picard, but I'm an Enterprise kid)
Battlestar Galactica. I don't think I need to explain why these are the best sci-fi characters ever created.
But Adama: he's a fucking boss. Complicated relationship with his son, supports Roslin, motivated by everyone he protects, a brilliant strategist, and gravitas for YEARS
But Adama: he's a fucking boss. Complicated relationship with his son, supports Roslin, motivated by everyone he protects, a brilliant strategist, and gravitas for YEARS
12 Monkeys. I actually missed the last season 
but I need to rewatch.
12 Monkeys is a masterpiece of time travel sci-fi and also tbh runs up pretty close to BSG in terms of instantly iconic characters in an extinction situation @IowaMasshole you'll hear this one again
but I need to rewatch.12 Monkeys is a masterpiece of time travel sci-fi and also tbh runs up pretty close to BSG in terms of instantly iconic characters in an extinction situation @IowaMasshole you'll hear this one again
Anyway Cole passes because he's
1: not the leader
2: takes the brunt of the trauma on the show
3: I can't explain how incredible he and Cassie are as a duo. Cassie as a character deserves her own thread
4: 12 Monkeys is mostly female driven as a show and it fucking rules
1: not the leader
2: takes the brunt of the trauma on the show
3: I can't explain how incredible he and Cassie are as a duo. Cassie as a character deserves her own thread
4: 12 Monkeys is mostly female driven as a show and it fucking rules
Agents of Shield. I love Coulson. He's great because he has like 3 lifetimes worth of trauma
, he's technically the leader but the team does most of the work, he eventually steps down as leader! That's a big one. And his arc is basically learning to pass on leadership. A+
, he's technically the leader but the team does most of the work, he eventually steps down as leader! That's a big one. And his arc is basically learning to pass on leadership. A+
Okay now: Sense8
Will exists because they couldn't have marketed this show without a white male lead I'm convinced of that.
He does have a dead girl in his backstory, but he didn't actually know her+it motivates his complex to take responsibility for literally everything
Will exists because they couldn't have marketed this show without a white male lead
I'm convinced of that.He does have a dead girl in his backstory, but he didn't actually know her+it motivates his complex to take responsibility for literally everything
And I can accept that because every terrible plot related thing that happens they put on Will. He's the team's trauma sponge. I find that acceptable.
Also he relies on Nomi, a hacker savant trans woman, for basically everything, and I love that and I love Nomi, so...
Also he relies on Nomi, a hacker savant trans woman, for basically everything, and I love that and I love Nomi, so...
As a Cis-Het man myself, Will helped me get invested in the show the first time I watched it. The second time through, I didn't care for him much, but he plays that important role, so it is what it is
I will add that over 2 seasons he goes from kinda uncomfortable when his heterosexuality is questioned to dancing shirtless between two other men+dancing on a float at pride and that is an excellent arc I gotta say
Not to mention their sense-orgies
Not to mention their sense-orgies
Elite. Not sci-fi but still needs mentioning. Guzman is THE blueprint for Cis-Het men for me going forward. A totally accepting ally of his gay and bi best friends, apologized for being shitty to Nadia, redeemed by love. He and Nadia are one of the best couples I've ever seen
Travelers. Amazing show, top tier. But Mack as a Cis-Het leader is boring. He's a good man, and that's important, and there's a touching episode about it, but he
isgeneric. Sorry, he doesn't pass. (But the show absolutely does)
isgeneric. Sorry, he doesn't pass. (But the show absolutely does)
Expanse. One of my faves.
In the books, he not only fails, he flops. Can't stand him. He's a generic space paladin.
BUT
I love show Holden. He's a coffee loving, idealistic, good hearted dork. He's also a good man. That is important.
The show saved him. I allow him a pass.
In the books, he not only fails, he flops. Can't stand him. He's a generic space paladin.
BUT
I love show Holden. He's a coffee loving, idealistic, good hearted dork. He's also a good man. That is important.
The show saved him. I allow him a pass.
Luther is the worst example of a bland completely replaceable male leader character and is pretty much responsible for this entire thread. He fucking fails. I hate him.
