Thread by @nightengale13, Do you know why #Etsy waived fees for Offsite Ads at the [...]

Do you know why #Etsy waived fees for Offsite Ads at the beginning of its run? So it could do this.

"Look how much money we brought you, and how little we cost you to do it!"

BULLSHIT.

This isn't realistic, or accurate. So here's what it's REALLY going to look like: (thread)

Let's do math, using our shop as an example. Since they launched, Etsy Offsite Ads have resulted in 359 clicks to our shop, and those clicks turned into 8 sales. That's a rate of 0.022%, which is...well, is that a good rate? Let's ask Google.

Survey says... not even close.

And let me be clear, I'm being generous here, because Etsy's statistic tells me how many *sales* I made from those clicks, but not how many impressions it took to get those clicks. So it's not technically the CTR but the conversion rate that they're offering.

But if the conversion rate is this low, how abysmally bad must the ACTUAL CTR be? How many 1000's of impressions did it take to get each of those 359 clicks? Etsy isn't going to tell me bc it's not a pretty number. And I'm a successful shop! These are higher numbers than average!

Etsy proudly advertises that it has posted ads on "high-traffic sites".

Look, here's us, advertised on Google! And here's how much we paid for the sale we made from that ad. Keep in mind, most shops would have paid $10.35, at "15%" fee. We pay $8.28, at "12%" fee.

Except, we didn't just pay $8.28. When you make a sale on Etsy, you also pay a listing fee ($0.20), transaction fee ($0.75), and a shipping fee ($0.30) if you use their integrated shipping method. AND THEN there's shipping, which Etsy strongly encourages you to offer for "free."

By "strongly encourages" I mean "buries your listings in 'organic' Etsy search results (and elsewhere) so your items won't get seen, even if you're a boss at keywords and tagging, if you don't offer it."

So the shipping cost is buried in there, too. In this case, it was $8.25.

So, if you're keeping score at home, this is what this sale looked like before the Offsite Ad and what it looks like now:

So, let's go back to that statistic Etsy happily told me, about how much money they made me.

If I add up all the Offsite Ads fees from the 8 transactions I made sales on, I get $32.67. Add the admin fees (listing, transaction, shipping) and we're up to $42.67.

But not only is the "you paid" statistic skewed by those one-time waived fees; the money they "brought me" (& omg, passive aggressive much?) is wrong also. Because - remember that free shipping penalty, where we have to offer it? Etsy suggested we 'roll it in' to our prices.

And most of us did, because shipping ISN'T free, and we were already working on narrow margins that can't take that hit.

But what that means now that the shipping costs are rolled into the item sale prices, is that Etsy can claim a bigger number that they "brought" us.

The number looks bigger, and shop owners get a bigger burst of serotonin, because money numbers go up! Yay! My brain does it too, man. But it's a lie.

So let's deflate that number back down to the money I would ACTUALLY KEEP under this new system:

Offsite Ads "brought me" $272.32 via 8 sales, 1 item each.
$272.32
- $1.60 listing fees
- $6.00 transaction fees
- $2.40 shipping 'service fees'
- $53.69 'free' shipping cost
= $208.54
- $32.67 Offline Ads fees
= $175.87.

Ouch.

I keep only *64.6%* of the big pretty number.

Now, calm down, Etsy tells us. That may *seem* like a lot, but because we're a special high sales shop, we're only paying a 12% rate for the Offsite Ads! Isn't that great?

You mean those ads that produce a mere 0.022% conversion rate from a totally unknown CTR?

Would YOU pay someone to run an ad campaign for you if they couldn't prove your ad spending was a solid investment? What kind of ad campaign won't even TELL YOU the CTR? Who would willingly pay for that?

(By the way, I'm using real numbers instead of made up numbers because too many zeroes make everyone's heads go funny. And because a vague thread is nobody's friend.)

So let's talk percentages.

Etsy Onsite Ads advertises that we, as a high traffic shop, will pay only 12% of our resultant sales for their service. Let's see where they get that number.

After everything, I pocketed $175.87 out of $208.53, paying Etsy OA $32.67.

So, the percent of my money I paid for Etsy OA is:
$32.67 ÷ $208.54 = 15.67%

But I thought I was a special shop who gets to pay only 12%?

Etsy "brought me" $272.32. There's $53.69 in there that was shipping costs - kept by neither me nor Etsy, paid to the USPS to get my stuff where it needs to go.

$32.67 ÷ 272.32 = 12%.

My "12%" fee is calculated using money that I never actually see. I actually pay 15.67%.

That's JUST for Offsite Ads. I was already paying 4.5%-5% for Etsy's existing fees:

$272.32 total "brought"
- $53.69 shipping
=
$217.63 sales

[Listing fee + ship fee + trans fee] $53.60
÷
sales $217.63
= 4.5%

For a site that's merely brokering my sales, that's fair.

And as a small business, I make my OWN hustle. I post, promote, and work to get my stuff in front of buyers.

And when I set my prices, I budget for 4.5% fees, plus materials, labor, equipment maintenance, & time. My margins are TINY.

I do NOT budget to lose a total of 16% MORE.

If I wanted an ad campaign, I'd budget for it, and I'd pay for it, and if it didn't work I'd stop the damn thing.

I don't want a campaign, but now have to budget for it anyway.
It isn't working. I can't turn it off. They're lying about the cost.

And Etsy doesn't give a crap.

$272.23 comes in.
USPS gets $53.69.

I get $218.54.

4.5%, normal Etsy fees, takes me to $208.54.
That's 77% of the money moving around. 95.5% of the share I'm entitled to. Ok.

But then of THAT,
Etsy claims $32.67 MORE. 15.67% more.

Etsy takes a total of 20.17% of my money.

The Offsite Ads QUADRUPLE the percentage of sellers' income being taken by Etsy. And we can't afford that. We can't turn it off. And it doesn't even produce results!

A 0.022% conversion rate entitles you to take nearly 16% more of my income? I think fucking not.

I've been on Etsy since 2008. Over 4000 sales, 5 star rating, 800+ reviews.

NONE of that happened because of anything besides the quality of my work, my own promotions, & the support of my customers.

What exactly does Etsy think its 0.022% sales conversion rate can offer me?

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