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Trent Alexander-Arnold vs Aaron Wan-Bissaka.
The big debate.
The big debate.
-I'll start off by saying I rate both of these players extremely highly, and it isn't going to be a thread attempting to score cheap points, but is more going to try and educate people on the debate.
-I will compare them, but I'll also debunk some myths surrounding the players.
-I will compare them, but I'll also debunk some myths surrounding the players.
-Now, we all know the strengths and weaknesses of two, which I will go into, but I'll be looking at what value the player actually brings to the team.
-I'll try and explain just HOW good they are at their particular strengths, compared to other full backs.
-I'll try and explain just HOW good they are at their particular strengths, compared to other full backs.
-So, to start, let's look at the role of these players.
-It's important to have a decent understanding of modern football roles and positioning.
-I've seen ignorant comments time and time again, saying "A RB's role is to defend, therefore AWB>Trent".
-It's important to have a decent understanding of modern football roles and positioning.
-I've seen ignorant comments time and time again, saying "A RB's role is to defend, therefore AWB>Trent".
-Now I'm sure most of us with half a brain know that's not true, and is just used in an attempt to score a quick point, but here's a quick fact to show what type of full back is valued in the modern game.
-Since 2009, Dani Alves and Marcelo have taken 14 of the 22 full back places in the FIFA world xi.
-They are by no means the two best defensive full backs of their generation, but are the two standouts, with their ability to go forward being the standout features of their game.
-They are by no means the two best defensive full backs of their generation, but are the two standouts, with their ability to go forward being the standout features of their game.
-Modern full backs have had completely different roles compared to full backs of the past.
-This is just to show how valued attacking full backs are in the modern game.
-This is just to show how valued attacking full backs are in the modern game.
-Now, usually when this is said, people jump and say "well at least they can actually defend, Trent can't defend to save his life!!!!!!"
-So, lets look at how true that actually is, and let’s compare their defensive abilities.
-So, lets look at how true that actually is, and let’s compare their defensive abilities.
-Before we look at numbers, it's important to know a bit about using stats to define defenders.
-The most common and ignorant mistake made, is people saying "more tackles, interceptions etc= better defender".
-For anyone with a brain, you’d know this is simply not true.
-The most common and ignorant mistake made, is people saying "more tackles, interceptions etc= better defender".
-For anyone with a brain, you’d know this is simply not true.
-A dumbed down explanation as to why, is due to two reasons.
-1) Teams with less of the ball have lots more opportunities to tackle or intercept etc.
-2) It shows more defensive STYLE, ie passive or aggressive, rather than ability.
-1) Teams with less of the ball have lots more opportunities to tackle or intercept etc.
-2) It shows more defensive STYLE, ie passive or aggressive, rather than ability.
-There's a reason the best defender isn't given based off of most tackles in the league etc.
-I'm sure no United fan will admit Brede Hangelaand was better than prime Vidic, simply based off of these raw stats.
-I'm sure no United fan will admit Brede Hangelaand was better than prime Vidic, simply based off of these raw stats.
-Judging defensive ability is harder than judging attacking ability, but we'll look at some different numbers anyway.
-(All these numbers are based on per 90 mins, in the last two PL seasons.)
-(All these numbers are based on per 90 mins, in the last two PL seasons.)
-So the one defensive measure you can see AWB is elite in, is Tackle/Dribbled past %.
-This is a measure of how many times you get dribbled past vs make a tackle.
-Aka, 1 v 1 defending ability.
-This is a measure of how many times you get dribbled past vs make a tackle.
-Aka, 1 v 1 defending ability.
-There's no doubt this is AWB's strongest part of his game, as you can see, he sits at 63.9%, which is in the 97th percentile for full backs in the top 5 leagues.
-Being in the 97th percentile, means you are better in this metric than 97% of other fullbacks.
-Being in the 97th percentile, means you are better in this metric than 97% of other fullbacks.
-Trent, who's 1v1 defending is probably his weakest ability, sits at 37.3%, in the 28th percentile, not good, but not the worse.
-Manchester United's Brandon Williams sits at 21.1%, in the 1st percentile, meaning literally 99% of fullbacks are better at 1v1 defending.
-Manchester United's Brandon Williams sits at 21.1%, in the 1st percentile, meaning literally 99% of fullbacks are better at 1v1 defending.
-However, this is where the problem is, far too many people see 1v1 defending as the only ability when judging overall defensive ability.
-Intercepting ability, pressuring ability, positional awareness etc are all equally as important.
-Intercepting ability, pressuring ability, positional awareness etc are all equally as important.
-We can see on the graphs, Trent averages 6.04 successful pressures per 90, and AWB averages 4.94.
-But more importantly, Trent has a pressure success rate of 33.4%, and AWB sits at 25.7%.
-But more importantly, Trent has a pressure success rate of 33.4%, and AWB sits at 25.7%.
-A succesfull pressure is defined by the opposing player losing the ball, whilst the defender is within 5 yards (pressing).
-This can be a forcing them off the pitch, forcing a bad pass etc.
-It’s a good measure of defending ability that involves positioning, not just tackling.
-This can be a forcing them off the pitch, forcing a bad pass etc.
-It’s a good measure of defending ability that involves positioning, not just tackling.
-Another measure is interceptions.
-As I said earlier, raw numbers are flawed, as players for worse teams have more opportunities to defend.
-But as the graph shows, AWB averages 2.1 per game, TAA at 1.99.
-As I said earlier, raw numbers are flawed, as players for worse teams have more opportunities to defend.
-But as the graph shows, AWB averages 2.1 per game, TAA at 1.99.
-Very interesting, sitting in practically the same percentile, and taking into account LFC have a lot more of the ball than United, you could make a strong case for Trent being the better interceptor.
-AWB is stronger in the air than Trent, displaying an 51.6% aerial success% vs Trent's 31.5%.
-With this, it's not similar to the 1v1 ability, where Trent wasn't great and AWB was elite.
-It's more Trent being very poor (7th percentile), and AWB being average (50th percentile)
-With this, it's not similar to the 1v1 ability, where Trent wasn't great and AWB was elite.
-It's more Trent being very poor (7th percentile), and AWB being average (50th percentile)
-A couple more defensive numbers:
-Trent commits 0.93 fouls per 90, with AWB at 0.57.
-Trent averages 4.09 clearances per 90, with AWB at 3.61.
-Trent commits 0.93 fouls per 90, with AWB at 0.57.
-Trent averages 4.09 clearances per 90, with AWB at 3.61.
-Now, I still do think AWB is the more solid defender, especially 1v1, but this was more to show Trent's ability, as it is often brushed off by people who just jump on the bandwagon.
-We saw Trent's pressuring and intercepting ability in the 88th and 90th percentile, solid.
-We saw Trent's pressuring and intercepting ability in the 88th and 90th percentile, solid.
-A quick note to come back to later, AWB averaged a 79th percentile when looking at the defensive full back metrics, with his best percentile being 97th, in the tackle/dribbled past %.
-Now, onto the attacking side of things.
-Now, onto the attacking side of things.
-As we know, Trent is very very good going forward, in terms of his creativity, and AWB is average going forward, similar to Trent's defending.
-The graph shows Trent leading in expected assists, passes into final third, and progressive distance, being in the 100th,99th and 97th percentile's in those.
-AWB has the higher pass success %, which can largely be put down to type of passes made.
-AWB has the higher pass success %, which can largely be put down to type of passes made.
-The same way Lovren has a higher pass success % than KDB, this obvoiously doesnt show who the better passer is, but more the type of passes attempted.
-This graph also shows the differences between the two in terms of creativity and even goal scoring.
-Now, the one area of going forward that AWB leads in, is dribbling, he boasts more dribbles per game, and a higher dribbling success %.
-This could be due to play style, and as a result, you can see AWB gets disposed more often than Trent does.
-This could be due to play style, and as a result, you can see AWB gets disposed more often than Trent does.
-The 'Progressive distance' metric, that Trent is in the 100th percentile for, is a measure of how far that player has gotten the ball forward, either by dribbling, or a successful pass forward.
-As we see, AWB is in the 39th percentile for this (below average).
-As we see, AWB is in the 39th percentile for this (below average).
-So despite AWB being the better dribbler, it isn't getting him anyway near up the pitch as Trent's passing and ball carrying.
-So as we've seen the numbers show AWB is better defensively, and Trent is better going forward, two things we already knew.
-But what I hope the numbers have shown, is that Trent is nowhere near a "bad" defender, and has strengths in intercepting and pressuring ability.
-But what I hope the numbers have shown, is that Trent is nowhere near a "bad" defender, and has strengths in intercepting and pressuring ability.
-So I guess the question is if trent is better going forward than AWB is at defending, or which abilities are valued more in the modern game.
-We can look at some overall ratings first.
-We can look at some overall ratings first.
Average PL match rating over last 2 seasons:
http://www.whoscored.com rating:
-TAA: 7.33
-AWB: 7.24
http://www.sofascore.com rating:
-TAA: 7.41
- AWB: 7.06
-Both statistically calculated ratings.
http://www.whoscored.com rating:
-TAA: 7.33
-AWB: 7.24
http://www.sofascore.com rating:
-TAA: 7.41
- AWB: 7.06
-Both statistically calculated ratings.
-A quick word on the term "system player", one of the worst terms to spread on football twitter, which seems to be exclusively for Liverpool players.
-People use it as a term to say a player is only good in a certain team.
-"Trent wouldn't be good if he played for another team", the exact same way AWB would be useless for LFC as his creative abilities aren't on the level needed for that system.
-"Trent wouldn't be good if he played for another team", the exact same way AWB would be useless for LFC as his creative abilities aren't on the level needed for that system.
-It's better to be a 'system player' that fits into the best system in the world, than in is to be one who fits into a bang average united team.
-Trent has the PL defender assit record (12), and has already matched that this season with 9 games to go.
-He has more assists last season (16) than any Marcelo season.
-He has 13 assists this season, with 9 games left, and could beat Dani Alves's 19 assists in a season.
-He has more assists last season (16) than any Marcelo season.
-He has 13 assists this season, with 9 games left, and could beat Dani Alves's 19 assists in a season.
-I'm not one for quotes, but former United players Gary Neville and Rio Ferdinand have both said Trent is currently the better of the two, with Ferdinand calling him the best right back in the world.
- https://metro.co.uk/2020/05/10/manchester-united-legend-gary-neville-picks-aaron-wan-bissaka-trent-alexander-arnold-12682279/ https://www.sportbible.com/football/news-rio-ferdinand-names-his-top-five-under-21-premier-league-players-20200324
- https://metro.co.uk/2020/05/10/manchester-united-legend-gary-neville-picks-aaron-wan-bissaka-trent-alexander-arnold-12682279/ https://www.sportbible.com/football/news-rio-ferdinand-names-his-top-five-under-21-premier-league-players-20200324
-There are a couple of full backs in the worlds who can defend at AWB's level.
-But no full back in the world is producing Trent's numbers going forward.
-But no full back in the world is producing Trent's numbers going forward.
-A quick look at individual honours speaks volumes of who has been rated more by their fellow pro's, managers and football writers, and which skill set is valued more in the modern game.
-There’s not much between them, but I think trent is a rarer talent, and has slightly more potential.
-He's done it at the highest level, AWB is yet to even play in the UCL.
-Trent therefore edges it for me.
End of thread.
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-He's done it at the highest level, AWB is yet to even play in the UCL.
-Trent therefore edges it for me.
End of thread.
Like and RT if you enjoyed!
