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Love Thy Neighbor: A Webinar on SOGIE Equality as a Religious Value

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Perci Cendaña, President of Babaylanes Inc.: Sa tulak natin sa pagpasa ng SOGIE Equality bill, ramdam natin yung tension na ito. Yung hugot ng oposition ay relihiyon. Ang pangunahing stumbling block ay religious priniciples.

Cendaña: Yung pananampalataya at pananalig mo ay humaharang sa’yo. Paano natin gagamitin ang relihiyon para maemancipate? Hinarap natin ang mga tanong na tinatakbo ng marami.

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Q1: What are the common experiences and unique challenges that LGBTQI people in your particular religion face?

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Rhadem Musawah: I am not a religious expert, unlike our other panelists, but I’ve done humanitarian work in Mindanao which upholds these religious values.

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Musawah: Outside our homes, Muslim people experience several issues such as employment issues. Known someone in Marawi that hasn’t been employed because he’s a gay man.

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Musawah: There are officials from Mindanao who were talking about what we can do about women in Mindanao and when brought up about women with diverse SOGIE,

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Musawah: they said that all women will be treated the same which should not be since women of diverse SOGIE experience different things.

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Musawah: On justice, there was a guy who murdered a gay guy (murderer is known homophobic), media did not acknowledge that it was a hate crime.

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Rev San Jose: Roman Catholic churches and families have some level of tolerance. Mas common ang tolerance and acceptance sa roman catholic families and churches. Obviously not totally accepted.

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Rev San Jose: We receive people of diversity. We hear stories and experiences of disownment and alienation once people find out about their SOGIE. There are different challenges depending on which Church group you actually come from.

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Rev Comon: Wala naman discrimination sa loob but more in the society. Kung may dalawang impyerno, kami ang unang impyerno. Di kami sumasamba sa diyos ng kristiyano at muslim. Tapos LGBT pa kami.

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Rev Comon: SOGIE and Religious value ay magkapantay. Pinapaalagaan namin ang kaluluwa. Kung ano ginagawa ng katawan mo, katawan mo yan. Ang hinarap ng simbahan ay hindi ang simbahan mismo pero ang society.

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Mitzi Angeles: Catholics are more accepting today but if they are not accepting then they don’t say much. I noticed in MM pride last year.

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Angeles: MM pride was quite the talk in their religious community. There were some that supported and some that didn’t.

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Angeles: There are different views of Catholics towards LGBTQI people.
Those that went out and marched and helped raise awareness,

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2. Apathetic- did not go outside nor actively engage/ respects but not actively engage. Non supporters mostly elders.

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Angeles: LGTQI community is just a trend “uso lang yan, marami gusto lang makigaya diyan” He felt weird kasi nakikita sila sa march and sa simbahan.

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Angeles: There are those that went out and marched and helped raise awareness. There are apathetic Catholics. They did not go outside nor actively engage/ respects but not actively engage.

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Angeles: Non supporters are mostly elders. They think being LGBTQI is just a trend. “Uso lang yan, marami gusto lang makigaya diyan.”

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Angeles: Religion doesn’t really matter at this point. We have this high deference to the elderly. May pinaglalaban tayo.

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Angeles: Meron tayo pinaglalaban dito, but there is still judgement and discrimination within the Church, especially of someone with over expressive gender expression.

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Angeles: During youth camps, people don’t take those of diverse SOGIE seriously. You will be respected regardless of SOGIE kung mukha kang ka-respet-respeto.

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Question 2: There is a view that being an advocate for SOGIE equality and being religious is not possible without compromising one or the other. What are your thoughts on this? Where does this view come from?

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Rev. Comon: SOGIE and religion be reconciled. Too much spirituality is dangerous. If we’re too spiritual, edi sumakabilang buhay ka na. Meron katawan at meron kaluluwa.

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Rev. Comon: Ang katawan natin ay ang SOGIE. This body will not be here without the spirit. Kailangan makiisa sa katawan. Without the acceptance of uniqueness and inequality, wala na. Kalaban natin ang discrimination.

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Rev. San Jose: Feminism was not compatible with Protestants in the west. Incompatible ang interracial marriage dati, in Catholic beliefs.

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Rev. San Jose: However, if we look at the history of many liberation movements, there were many influential people motivated by their faith.

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Rev. San Jose: Same with the movement for social equality, there are many people motivated by their faith for social equality.

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Rev. San Jose: Reconciliation is possible and has been happening forever. Just as much that oppressors use faith to oppress, the oppressed also use faith to fight back.

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Rev. San Jose: What may seem to be conflicting theological and social practices, same with the LGBT. Malalim ang ugat ng gay liberation movement sa faith.

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Rev. San Jose: We have been there from the very start since Stonewall and Pride. Hindi totoo na walang religious sectors sa liberation and human rights movement. We have a way of reconciling faith and social justice.

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Musawah: This comes from old culture and traditions and lack of education and awareness in Mindanao. People feel like they’re being left behind in regard to programs.

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Musawah: Historical oppression against the Moros. They are growing campaigns against Islam, asserting their religion.

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Musawah: Moros don’t know what SOGIE is. SOGIE is associated with homosexuality when in fact it is not. We need Cis-Het SOGIE Equality champions. We need them to talk about it.

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Musawah: That will be threatening to the Muslim community. Problem boils down to how advocates move, we talk about SOGIE in the language of the North and of Metro Manila and that creates a barrier and fear.

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Musawah: We have growing SOGIE equality supporters in the Muslim community but they are afraid to speak out. We have different types of upbringing and accepting these modern narratives.

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Musawah: It affects how we understand diversity. There were lots of conservative people who rallied behind a woman candidate, Samira Gutoc.

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Musawah: There are people who are conservative but progressing and there are people who are still conservative.

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Musawah: Globalization helps to expose Muslims to equality and liberation. Exposure helps with acceptance. Some Muslims protects LGBT groups. It is wrong to say the opposite.

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Rev. Comon: It’s not lack of education in terms of acceptance. It’s religious education. Nung unang panahon, wala namang discrimination. Babaylans, two spirited poeple.

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Rev. Comon: Ginalingan ng Catholics and Muslims in dividing us in terms of man and woman. Ang unang nagprotesta ay si Babaylan. Mas convenient ang religious education. They found spirituality as their own form and rhythm.

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Rev. Comon: Wala naman tinuro si Kristo na "bakla ka bawal ka dito sa akin." I can wear whatever I want to wear, but as long as I’m in a public place I wear appropriate clothes. Ang laging pinapairal ay religious education nila.

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Angeles: It comes from history and traditional Catholic families who claim na ang tinuturo ng bible: "God only created Man and Woman." We are living proof that being LGBTQI and an advocate for equality is possible.

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Angeles: It is not a matter of compromising, but rather intergrating both identities into one. Di naman kailangan mamili kung pwede sabayan into one.

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Musawah: One of the problems in being in a SOGIE-marginalized group as a Muslim is being stigmatized due to homophobia.

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Musawah: Lots of Catholics are asking Muslims to renounce faith due to homophobia in Islam. We face both homophobia and Islamophobia.

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Musawah: Homophobia is everyone’s problem. It is not right to point out that it is the problem of Islam. It is everyone’s problem.

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Question: What are myths or misconceptions that other members of your religion propagate about LGBTQI people, and how true are they?

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Rev. San Jose: There is nothing in the Bible that explains the sexuality we know today (explanation of sexuality via psychology, anthropology, scientifically, academically.)

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Rev. San Jose: Ang tingin ng iba, ang biblia ay literal word of God. Inspired word of God is not the actual word of God. The different books of the Bible are the product of its ancient pre-modern time.

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Rev. San Jose: Many parts of the bible are relevant only to the time when they were written.

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Rev. San Jose: Biblia ay literal na salita na diyos, hindi ito totoo. The bibles we have access to today are translations.

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Rev. San Jose: Bibles are for our interpretation. We don’t read the bible tabula rasa.

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Rev. San Jose: Many of the misconceptions about the LGBTQI community and SOGIE are nothing more than bad interpretations that seem to be talking about homosexuality.

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Rev. San Jose: Sodom and Gomorrah is nothing more than a superficial and selective reading. Babalik tayo sa mas scientific and academic/scholarly study of the bible.

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Rev. San Jose: In order to understand passages of the bible, we have to take into consideration the context and understand if this is still relevant to us today.

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Rev. San Jose: Myth: Homosexuality is a sin. The writers of the bible did not understand sexuality. We should not defer to the bible when talking about sexuality.

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Rev. Comon: Ang paniniwala sa Diyos bilang lalaki or babae lamang ay pamahiin din. Paano nilikha ng Diyos ang sarili niya kung mag-isa lang siya?

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Rev. Comon: Creation is both feminine and masculine. Filipino gods exhibit duality in the concept of god, it is not entirely masculine and feminine and not completely matriarchal or patriarchal.

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Rev. Comon: We have balance and harmony of our gender. Our energies are both masculine and feminine. Iisa lang ang diyos.

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Musawah: Qur'an is just guidance on how we should live our lives.

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Musawah: The story of Lot condemns the act and not homosexual people.

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Musawah: It is only the almighty Allah who can give the final judgement. Let’s wait until Allah puts homosexual people in Hell or in Heaven (jokingly).

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Question: SOGIE equality a religious value? Why? How? What tenets or teachings in your religion can prove this?

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Angeles: Equality itself is a religious value.

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Angeles: Mark 12:31 says “You should love your neighbor as yourself. There is no commandment greater than this.”
This includes people of all genders and be respectful because everyone is created in God’s image and likeness.

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Angeles: As long as you have strong faith in God, nothing can stop you from praising him.

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Angeles: John 13:34 “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.”

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Angeles: In Ephesians 2:8-9, it says “For the grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.”

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Rev. San Jose: Equality is a goal and ambition we are working towards. On the religious part, equality is grounded in the belief that everyone is created in the image and likeness of God.

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Rev. San Jose: Everyone has dignity, has rights, has value. Sense of community is radically inclusive.

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Rev. San Jose: Inclusivity was the core to the ministry of Jesus Christ. He tried to include as many people in his movement. It was intentional to include people that were rejected by society and religion.

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Rev. San Jose: Each person has value and should be included at his table.

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Rev. San Jose: Paul - Galatians 3:28 says “There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.”

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Rev. San Jose: Christ’s mission is to bring equality and justice to all people.

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Rev. Comon: In our faith, SOGIE is the balance of who we are. Balance includes harmony with other people, accepting and including them.

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Question: How should we engage with religious sectors (from both sides of the issue) in promoting SOGIE equality? What are current efforts by people of faith in the fight for SOGIE equality? How can we improve them?

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Rev. Comon: There should be an interfaith movement for SOGIE equality. Hindi tayo magkakaaway na relihiyon, lahat tayo ay may puso ng pagmamahalan.

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Rev. Comon: Need for interfaith visibility for peace amongst the different aspects of society (politics, etc). Kailangan ng acceptance kasi lahat may pangangailangan.

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Musawah: There is a growing rise of number of women rights activists in the Muslim community. They can be tapped to help with the understanding of SOGIE.

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Musawah: If people from the North are the ones to do it, it might be threatening. There is a mosque in Zamboanga that helps the LGBT community to get education and jobs. They are the first community to embrace the LGBT communities.

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Musawah: The elder was conservative but he considers LGBTQI members of the barangay as part of his family and would be willing to even allow them to marry if the law ever gets passed.

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Rev. San Jose: We should build relationships and networks among progressive religious groups. We should struggle to create spaces which are more inclusive.

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Rev. San Jose: The Aglipayan church has declared nationally that they will accept LGBTQI people.

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Rev. San Jose: We need more accepting and inclusive churches. However, we should not engage with fundamentalists whose 100% commitment is to continue oppression.

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Angeles: Join and be active in the religion. Do something to debunk the negative view against the LGBTQ Community.

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Angeles: Being seen in a Catholic organization is just a start. Doing simple charity will do and there is no need to promote, we just need to be sincere. Once people notice, people will start looking up to you.

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Angeles: After everything you will know that you have been successful in promoting SOGIE Equality but also practicing your religious values.

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Angeles: The story of Pope Francis helping a trans community is proof we can do it. If the head of the Catholic Church can do something to promote SOGIE equality, why can’t we?

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Question: What is your message to LGBTQI people of faith in the Philippines?

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Rev. Comon: Being religious and LGBT is a struggle in a predominantly religious and Catholic country. Kung ang simbahan ang tumatanggi sa LGBT, sino ang tatanggap sa kanila?

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Rev. Comon: Lahat ng simbahan, kahit ano man relihiyon mo, ay importante upang lumapit sa Diyos. Iparamdam natin sa mga kapatid nating LGBT na mahal sila sa Diyos.

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Musawah: There’s a mosque in Indonesia that caters to the LGBTQ community. If there’s an opportunity to talk about compromising, accept it but be aware of the contexts we are all coming from.

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Musawah: Intersecting marginalization prevents a lot of discourse. One of the challenges in the community is still diversity and the lack of different faces that represents the individual members of the community.

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Musawah: Samira Gutoc once told me: “If your faith community will not accept or respect you, go to one that will. Blood does not make a family, love does.”

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Musawah: No one can force you to make a relationship grow. Be understanding of the different situations that people are going through. Bloom with others.

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Musawah: When you read the scripture, read it with diversity, coexistence and human rights in mind. That will enrich your faith.

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Rev. San Jose: If we study history, many religious people fought for human rights due to religious conviction. It’s an imperative in our faith to fight for justice.

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Rev. San Jose: Bryan Zahnd said God is not doctrine. God is not denomination. God is not war. God is not law. God is not hate. God is not hell...God is Love.

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Rev. San Jose: Our families may reject us, but we hold on to the truth that God loves us. Ang kabuuan mo ay ang pag-ibig ng Diyos. That same love calls you to come out and live your truth the way Jesus did.

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Rev. San Jose: It is not easy. Search out because you are not and never will be alone. 365 times in the Bible, it says we should not be afraid because God loves us. May each one of you receive God’s rainbow love.

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Angeles: Do what you gotta do without stepping on other people. Never let those kind of people win. We are all free to choose who we want to love and who we want to be.

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Angeles: Give yourself a chance. They are not you, you are you. It’s time for you to be free and feel what you truly feel.

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Angeles: As long as you are not causing pain or harm to others, allow yourself to be you. It may not always be rainbows and butterflies, but it will get better.

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Angeles: To quote Kim Nam-joon, “No matter who you are, where you’re from, your skin colour, gender identity: speak yourself. Find your name, find your voice by speaking yourself.”

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Question to Rev. San Jose: Is the bible outdated?

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Rev. San Jose: The bible, in terms of the books, is actually updated because thy continue to update the translations in terms of how accurate they are to the original writing.

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Rev. San Jose: The things about slavery and anti-women narratives, we can not do anything about them since they have been written already.

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Rev. San Jose: The bible is a product of its time. What we can do right now is update how we interpret the Bible. What was written 2000 or 3000 years ago does not translate to today’s society.

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Rev. San Jose: We need to consider what lens we use to draw out the messages we get from the bible. Lente ba ito ng machismo or lente ba ito ng pagmamahalan?

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Rev. San Jose: The question should be: how would Jesus understand this? How would Jesus do this? We don’t quote the bible for our message, we quote the bible for who Jesus is.

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Question: There are LGBTQI+ advocates who argue that fighting for LGBTQI+ rights should remain secular. As religious leaders/representatives, why is it important to address religion/spirituality within the LGBTQI+ rights movement?

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Rev. Comon: Para sa pre-colonial faiths, ang pakikibaka para sa mga LGBTQ ay hindi secular lamang pero ito ay isang uri ng religious revolution. Dahil sa pagdating ng kristyanismo ay nademonize ang mga Babaylan.

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Rev. Comon: Ang damit na parang nakasaya ay gender neutral. Ang pakikibaka ay hindi secular lamang dahil we are fighting for our rights not only as a minority religion but for the rest of the global LGBTQI community.

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Musawah: There are a lot of cases of gender-based violence in Mindanao that do not match the teaching of compassion in the Qur'an. They need to make sure that the right to live and exist should still prevail.

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Rev. San Jose: What does this mean to my religion? What does this mean to my faith? Kailangan pa rin ng boses ng progresibong Kristyano para maipaglaban ang human rights.

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Rev. San Jose: Kailangan ng boses ng mga progresibong Kristyano para mapakita na may iba pang boses bukod sa konserbatibo.

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Rev. San Jose: Looking at history, we can see many figures for social justice who had religious motives: Martin Luther King, Gandhi, Rosa Parks, etc.

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Angeles: The movement for LGBTQI rights should not be secular. We do not have to choose one over the other because both should be integrated into one.

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Angeles: We give importance of both. How we practice as advocates become the models for those outside.

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Question to Musawah: Do Muslims in the Philippines mirror the extremist views of the Arab Nations towards the LGBT? or do they have some form of autonomy towards this issue. Do they feel as passionate?

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Musawah: Yes, Filipino Muslims have autonomy on this issue. Muslim beliefs condemn the homosexual act but not the people. A lot of Muslim people denounce violence because they believe in compassion.

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Musawah: We are more Filipino-ish Muslim rather than Arab-Muslim. We would rather be friends rather than close the door.

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Our panel discussion has now ended! Thank you so much for joining us!

Join us in demanding for #SOGIEEqualityNOW by participating in our Twitter Rally co-moderated by PANTAY on Friday, 8PM! Let’s commemorate #IDAHOTB2020 the best way we know how - speaking up against discrimination and fighting for equality!