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> as an author who really started dreaming about storytelling after I played <videogame> as a kid
ahhh, suddenly a lot of things got really clear
ahhh, suddenly a lot of things got really clear
2/
it's called manners
not every disagreement about artistic quality needs to tag a guy in and ridicule him by name for how bad he is at his craft https://twitter.com/AndrewLoeschner/status/1252982816259936257
it's called manners
not every disagreement about artistic quality needs to tag a guy in and ridicule him by name for how bad he is at his craft https://twitter.com/AndrewLoeschner/status/1252982816259936257
3/
but to get back to the core point about "I was inspired to write by video games", the reason that this is terrible is based off of something I touched on the other day when talking about fantasy and magic systems https://twitter.com/MorlockP/status/1251572921568550912
but to get back to the core point about "I was inspired to write by video games", the reason that this is terrible is based off of something I touched on the other day when talking about fantasy and magic systems https://twitter.com/MorlockP/status/1251572921568550912
4/
videogames and literature are deeply different genres, and what works in one not only doesn't work, but often fails miserably in another
Videogames depend on colors, weapon mechanics, button-mashing to execute specific maneuvers, and visual effects.
videogames and literature are deeply different genres, and what works in one not only doesn't work, but often fails miserably in another
Videogames depend on colors, weapon mechanics, button-mashing to execute specific maneuvers, and visual effects.
5/
...but if you try to write a novel like this, the result is ... a breath-takingly terrible train wreck, e.g.
...but if you try to write a novel like this, the result is ... a breath-takingly terrible train wreck, e.g.
6/
we've got everything here - flickering light sources, weapon choice optimized for range and damage, statistics at the top right of the screen (I'm sorry, at the top right of the character's PoV), cringey dialogue, intricate button mashing combat maneuvers, damage per hit
we've got everything here - flickering light sources, weapon choice optimized for range and damage, statistics at the top right of the screen (I'm sorry, at the top right of the character's PoV), cringey dialogue, intricate button mashing combat maneuvers, damage per hit
7/
This is not just terrible writing - the worst I've read in 40+ years of reading fantasy and science fiction - it is a PARTICULAR TYPE of terrible writing.
And THAT is what I was getting at in my initial tweet "ahhh, suddenly a lot of things got really clear"
This is not just terrible writing - the worst I've read in 40+ years of reading fantasy and science fiction - it is a PARTICULAR TYPE of terrible writing.
And THAT is what I was getting at in my initial tweet "ahhh, suddenly a lot of things got really clear"
8/
Specifically, what became clear is that this author's specific manner of being abysmally embarrassingly bad - this author is ignorant of what good writing entails, but he's DEEPLY aware of what a video game looks like.
And I find that fascinating.
Specifically, what became clear is that this author's specific manner of being abysmally embarrassingly bad - this author is ignorant of what good writing entails, but he's DEEPLY aware of what a video game looks like.
And I find that fascinating.
9/
...and I bet he's not alone.
I bet that there is a lot of very bad writing that fails in this exact same way. I mean, I doubt it's AS bad - this is quite breathtaking - but I bet that there's not-as-bad-but-similar out there.
/exeunt
...and I bet he's not alone.
I bet that there is a lot of very bad writing that fails in this exact same way. I mean, I doubt it's AS bad - this is quite breathtaking - but I bet that there's not-as-bad-but-similar out there.
/exeunt
10/
I haven't blocked the bad author - he's blocked me.
And it's not whining, it's criticism / analysis.
I'm not trying to hurt the author's feelings - I'm trying to educate others on what makes good art. https://twitter.com/benkeiser3/status/1252987421924438019
I haven't blocked the bad author - he's blocked me.
And it's not whining, it's criticism / analysis.
I'm not trying to hurt the author's feelings - I'm trying to educate others on what makes good art. https://twitter.com/benkeiser3/status/1252987421924438019
11/
Afraid? Your only conception of why I might choose not to do something is fear?
Interesting. https://twitter.com/AndrewLoeschner/status/1252989194529579010
Afraid? Your only conception of why I might choose not to do something is fear?
Interesting. https://twitter.com/AndrewLoeschner/status/1252989194529579010
12/
No, I'm criticizing bad artwork, and explaining why it is bad so that others do not make the same mistakes.
Standards exist, aesthetics are real, skills are learnable, and using the magic words "indie" or "pulprev" doesn't make any of that untrue. https://twitter.com/MorganColeBooks/status/1252990346331553792
No, I'm criticizing bad artwork, and explaining why it is bad so that others do not make the same mistakes.
Standards exist, aesthetics are real, skills are learnable, and using the magic words "indie" or "pulprev" doesn't make any of that untrue. https://twitter.com/MorganColeBooks/status/1252990346331553792
13/
Little cultural ghettoes suffer from this all time time:
Frank's grain may be moldy, but he's a farmer like us - how could you criticize him?
Jim's writing may suck, but he's an indy - how could you criticize him?
Susan's cakes are stale, but she's a Christian like us -
Little cultural ghettoes suffer from this all time time:
Frank's grain may be moldy, but he's a farmer like us - how could you criticize him?
Jim's writing may suck, but he's an indy - how could you criticize him?
Susan's cakes are stale, but she's a Christian like us -
14/
Low standards, and pretending that a barrel of feces is actually a barrel of fine wine does no one any favors, harms the consumer, degrades the art form, and makes every transaction more dangerous because lemons lurk and are unidentified.
Low standards, and pretending that a barrel of feces is actually a barrel of fine wine does no one any favors, harms the consumer, degrades the art form, and makes every transaction more dangerous because lemons lurk and are unidentified.
15/
Saying that terrible writing is good just because "the guy is trying to support his family" insults all of the good writing out there, by saying that it's in the same category as this embarrassing mess.
Further, lies (and that's what you're advocating) harm authors.
Saying that terrible writing is good just because "the guy is trying to support his family" insults all of the good writing out there, by saying that it's in the same category as this embarrassing mess.
Further, lies (and that's what you're advocating) harm authors.
16/
Inaccurate feedback encourages people to go public with unworthy works.
Accurate feedback helps.
Some can keep polishing their craft in private, until they're good enough.
Others can realize that they will never have the skill to write at an acceptable level, and quit.
Inaccurate feedback encourages people to go public with unworthy works.
Accurate feedback helps.
Some can keep polishing their craft in private, until they're good enough.
Others can realize that they will never have the skill to write at an acceptable level, and quit.
17/
say what you will about his writing, but it's got a high polygon count and good textures https://twitter.com/The_Petrichory/status/1252991390704779264
say what you will about his writing, but it's got a high polygon count and good textures https://twitter.com/The_Petrichory/status/1252991390704779264
18/
I've already explained this, twice, I think.
But, a third time:
I am educating customers on what good writing does and does not look like.
I don't need to hurt someone's feelings to do that, and therefore I don't. https://twitter.com/benkeiser3/status/1252990375360376834
I've already explained this, twice, I think.
But, a third time:
I am educating customers on what good writing does and does not look like.
I don't need to hurt someone's feelings to do that, and therefore I don't. https://twitter.com/benkeiser3/status/1252990375360376834
19/
1) I'm not crapping on him; I'm crapping on his writing - the worst I've seen in 43 years of reading F&SF
2) I don't care that he's trying to make a go of it; he should learn to write acceptably first, or - if he can't - just not write. https://twitter.com/MorganColeBooks/status/1252992523095728129
1) I'm not crapping on him; I'm crapping on his writing - the worst I've seen in 43 years of reading F&SF
2) I don't care that he's trying to make a go of it; he should learn to write acceptably first, or - if he can't - just not write. https://twitter.com/MorganColeBooks/status/1252992523095728129
20/
> Are you honor bound to shit on everything you don't like?
Not at all.
I only talk on a topic when I think that there's an interesting analytical framework.
> Are you honor bound to shit on everything you don't like?
Not at all.
I only talk on a topic when I think that there's an interesting analytical framework.
21/
But let me turn that around - are you honor bound to crap on me for raising absolutely valid criticism's about this guy's writing?
Why not use that energy to provide feedback to him, explaining that his writing is bad and should be improved?
But let me turn that around - are you honor bound to crap on me for raising absolutely valid criticism's about this guy's writing?
Why not use that energy to provide feedback to him, explaining that his writing is bad and should be improved?
22/
(I mean, I don't actually find your engagement on this topic to be "crapping on me" ; it's fine, and I welcome it. I'm just using your framing to address things.)
(I mean, I don't actually find your engagement on this topic to be "crapping on me" ; it's fine, and I welcome it. I'm just using your framing to address things.)
23/
yep!
and someone could write a good novel, I assert, inspired a Dwarf Fortress game ... but it wouldn't / shouldn't READ like a DF game ! https://twitter.com/usernameavaila4/status/1252993101620273153
yep!
and someone could write a good novel, I assert, inspired a Dwarf Fortress game ... but it wouldn't / shouldn't READ like a DF game ! https://twitter.com/usernameavaila4/status/1252993101620273153
24/
well, if you think that the author in question would be well served by reading a scathing critique of his non-existent writing skills, by all means, feel free to contact him and show him my tweets
I, personally, don't think he would be. https://twitter.com/benkeiser3/status/1252993717310574593
well, if you think that the author in question would be well served by reading a scathing critique of his non-existent writing skills, by all means, feel free to contact him and show him my tweets
I, personally, don't think he would be. https://twitter.com/benkeiser3/status/1252993717310574593
25/
I think he is unlikely to be able to learn from the feedback (so invested is he in the narrative that he is ALREADY so good at writing that he takes money from others to instruct them on his method), but is emotionally brittle and would have his feelings hurt.
/shrug
I think he is unlikely to be able to learn from the feedback (so invested is he in the narrative that he is ALREADY so good at writing that he takes money from others to instruct them on his method), but is emotionally brittle and would have his feelings hurt.
/shrug
26/
No.
No.
A thousand times, no.
There are different genres and different styles, and de gustibus non est disputandum, but technique and skill are objective.
Tolkien and Niven are different and great in different ways.
...and some things are bad. https://twitter.com/RobHaines905/status/1252995450916962304
No.
No.
A thousand times, no.
There are different genres and different styles, and de gustibus non est disputandum, but technique and skill are objective.
Tolkien and Niven are different and great in different ways.
...and some things are bad. https://twitter.com/RobHaines905/status/1252995450916962304
27/
> Becuase really your just coming off as a condescending elitist
yes
I have a better understanding of what makes skilled writing, because I have diligently studied the topic, and I am condescending to explain it to people who have not.
We are in agreement.
> Becuase really your just coming off as a condescending elitist
yes
I have a better understanding of what makes skilled writing, because I have diligently studied the topic, and I am condescending to explain it to people who have not.
We are in agreement.
28/
> It's not a good look.
We've already established that I care about what the masters & skilled technicians of the craft have to share about how they perform their magic.
...and that you do not.
...so why would I care what you think of the fact that I care about standards?
> It's not a good look.
We've already established that I care about what the masters & skilled technicians of the craft have to share about how they perform their magic.
...and that you do not.
...so why would I care what you think of the fact that I care about standards?
