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I will be finally making a thread on why the Phantom Troupe phenomenal, and my fav cast of characters in anime :)
This will be a pretty long thread, so here we go!
This will be a pretty long thread, so here we go!
Before I start this thread, I have to give credit to @Aleczandxr for his Chrollo and Troupe videos.
I would not have come to some of my conclusions about the Troupe without his videos, so be sure to check out his channel!
I would not have come to some of my conclusions about the Troupe without his videos, so be sure to check out his channel!
I will also be tying in my thoughts on Chrollo in this thread because what makes the Troupe special does overlap with what makes Chrollo special as well :)
I will also be addressing the themes of Yorknew City and Kurapika as well, because they tie in with why the Troupe and Chrollo are phenomenal :)
First off, who are the Troupe?
The Troupe are a group of 13 thieves led by Chrollo Lucilfer. They have an A rank bounty, and to them, killing is like breathing.
The Troupe are a group of 13 thieves led by Chrollo Lucilfer. They have an A rank bounty, and to them, killing is like breathing.
What is the motive of the Troupe?
This is a question that I find a lot of ppl have about the Troupe. What is their reason for stealing and killing? Allow me to explain :)
This is a question that I find a lot of ppl have about the Troupe. What is their reason for stealing and killing? Allow me to explain :)
Most Troupe members came from Meteor City.
Meteor City is a dumpster, and the ppl living there have no purpose in life.
They have been tossed aside by society.
Meteor City is a dumpster, and the ppl living there have no purpose in life.
They have been tossed aside by society.
They have no identity in life.
This is the reason why Chrollo decided to form the Troupe.
He formed it to give him and his members a sense of identity and purpose in life.
This is the reason why Chrollo decided to form the Troupe.
He formed it to give him and his members a sense of identity and purpose in life.
The Spider don't steal for fame, fortune, etc.
They steal to give their lives purpose. This is why they constantly say "We're thieves.".
This reinforces who they are.
They steal to give their lives purpose. This is why they constantly say "We're thieves.".
This reinforces who they are.
The Troupe provides the members of the Spider with identity, something they desperately needed.
Also, the rules of the Spider are structured so that new members can join in if an opposing member dies.
Chrollo places emphasis on the Spider's survival over himself. Why is this?
Chrollo places emphasis on the Spider's survival over himself. Why is this?
His identity is tied to the Spider, so even if he dies, the Spider will live on and thus his identity will live on.
This is why he does not fear death when he is with Kurapika.
This is why he does not fear death when he is with Kurapika.
The rest of the Troupe members share a similar sentiment.
Their identity is tied to the Troupe, and have no problem dying if it benefits the Troupe.
Their identity is tied to the Troupe, and have no problem dying if it benefits the Troupe.
Chrollo's power hints at this identity stuff also.
Nen is a highly personal power system. Chrollo is the leader of the Phantom Troupe, a group of thieves, and his identity is tied to the Spider.
Having a power that involves stealing Hatsu is perfect :)
Nen is a highly personal power system. Chrollo is the leader of the Phantom Troupe, a group of thieves, and his identity is tied to the Spider.
Having a power that involves stealing Hatsu is perfect :)
Now, through the Troupe working together and having the same mutual suffering they faced in Meteor City, they have a strong sense of comradery and care deeply for one another.
Identity and Comradery are 2 of the primary themes of Yorknew.
They apply to both Kurapika and the Troupe.
They apply to both Kurapika and the Troupe.
When Uvo is about to die, he stays silent.
This is because his identity is tied to the Spider, so the Spider is more important than his survival, but also because he cares deeply for the other members.
This is because his identity is tied to the Spider, so the Spider is more important than his survival, but also because he cares deeply for the other members.
Near the end of Yorknew, the two themes clash against each other.
Should Pakunoda save the boss but betray the Spider, prioritizing comradery?
Or should she take the other Troupe members with her, kill the chain user, and let the boss die, prioritizing her identity?
Should Pakunoda save the boss but betray the Spider, prioritizing comradery?
Or should she take the other Troupe members with her, kill the chain user, and let the boss die, prioritizing her identity?
All Troupe members value identity and comradery, but each of them values them unevenly.
Chrollo, Phinks, Feitan, Shalnark, and Shizuku prioritize identity.
The rest prioritize comradery and wish to save the boss.
Chrollo, Phinks, Feitan, Shalnark, and Shizuku prioritize identity.
The rest prioritize comradery and wish to save the boss.
The Troupe and Kurapika have parallels with one another.
Kurapika is a kind and compassionate person by nature, but he is forced to do stuff he despises out of a sense of duty.
By going after Troupe members and reclaiming his eyes, he is losing his identity.
Kurapika is a kind and compassionate person by nature, but he is forced to do stuff he despises out of a sense of duty.
By going after Troupe members and reclaiming his eyes, he is losing his identity.
On the other hand, the Troupe via killing is reinforcing their identity.
The Troupe grew up in a terrible place, while Kurapika had a loving clan.
The Troupe share a sense of comradery, and so does Kurapika with Gon and Killua.
The Troupe grew up in a terrible place, while Kurapika had a loving clan.
The Troupe share a sense of comradery, and so does Kurapika with Gon and Killua.
In the end of Yorknew City, there are nice parallels with Kurapika and Pakunoda.
By saving Gon and Killua over killing the boss, Kurapika regains his identity (kind person) and comradery.
However, Pakunoda keeps her comradery but loses identity.
By saving Gon and Killua over killing the boss, Kurapika regains his identity (kind person) and comradery.
However, Pakunoda keeps her comradery but loses identity.
When Uvo dies, Chrollo along with the Troupe members feel as though they have lost a comrade along with a piece of their identity.
So they mourn and take out their rage on the society that abandoned them because that is all they can do.
So they mourn and take out their rage on the society that abandoned them because that is all they can do.
In essence, the Troupe are phenomenal because of their identity and comradery and how well they are executed throughout the story, along with the beautiful parallels they have Kurapika.
In addition, each member values both but prioritizes the 2 unevenly, have unique designs and powers, and unique character quirks which lends really well to the individual nature of the Troupe members as well :)
The Troupe succeeds in spades on both a group and individual level.
The Troupe succeeds in spades on both a group and individual level.
This thread is far from done; I will continue shortly :)
Alright, time to continue the thread :)
When Chrollo talks to Uvogin, he says that they don't steal for fame, fortune, or prestige.
They do it to give themselves identity and purpose, which is not one of the things he mentions.
They do it to give themselves identity and purpose, which is not one of the things he mentions.
When Chrollo is asked by Gon why they do the stuff they do, he cannot give a proper answer.
Doing stuff for a sense of identity and purpose is not something that can easily be put into words, and as such, it makes perfect sense why Chrollo cannot understand it.
Doing stuff for a sense of identity and purpose is not something that can easily be put into words, and as such, it makes perfect sense why Chrollo cannot understand it.
Now, I am going to try to focus on Chrollo for the rest of the thread.
Some overlap with the Spider is inevitable because Chrollo identifies himself as the spider, but I will do my best to focus on him :)
Some overlap with the Spider is inevitable because Chrollo identifies himself as the spider, but I will do my best to focus on him :)
As I said before, all Troupe members value identity and comradery.
Chrollo is the one that values identity the most above all other Troupe members.
He clearly values comradery as well, but identity is first and foremost for him.
Chrollo is the one that values identity the most above all other Troupe members.
He clearly values comradery as well, but identity is first and foremost for him.
He is the person who best represents the ideals of the Spider, and it makes sense because he is the one who started the Spider.
He poured his whole identity into the Spider, which is why he has a pretty blank personality.
He poured his whole identity into the Spider, which is why he has a pretty blank personality.
He places such emphasis on the Spider above himself, and this is why he wants Pakunoda to bring everyone to take down the chain user.
As I said before, his identity is tied to the Spider, so even if he dies, the Spider will live, and thus, his identity will live on.
As I said before, his identity is tied to the Spider, so even if he dies, the Spider will live, and thus, his identity will live on.
Other instances of him valuing identity I talked about in the previous parts like Uvo's requiem, not fearing death with Kurapika, etc.
Now, I want to address the fate aspect of Chrollo.
Now, I want to address the fate aspect of Chrollo.
There is evidence throughout the series to suggest the Troupe are religious.
Chrollo and Shizuku both have crosses, Chrollo references Judas at one point, etc.
Chrollo and Shizuku both have crosses, Chrollo references Judas at one point, etc.
Chrollo has a belief in predestination throughout HxH.
Here is the proof for this:
Here is the proof for this:
When Chrollo is having a fight with Hisoka, he tells him that he has a 100% chance of winning, and asks Hisoka if he wants to continue.
He thinks that Hisoka is predestined to lose, so he doesn't see the point of this fight.
He thinks that Hisoka is predestined to lose, so he doesn't see the point of this fight.
However, Hisoka says he will continue and Chrollo is intrigued, commenting on how humans are interesting.
He finds it interesting that ppl are willing to reject fate and follow their own path.
He finds it interesting that ppl are willing to reject fate and follow their own path.
When Chrollo is talking to Uvogin on the phone, he states that Judas is not a traitor.
This makes sense given Chrollo's predestination philosophy, because if Judas was predestined to betray Jesus, then he had no control over his actions and was not a traitor.
This makes sense given Chrollo's predestination philosophy, because if Judas was predestined to betray Jesus, then he had no control over his actions and was not a traitor.
However, the biggest piece of evidence IMO is the coin flip.
The coin flip is used to resolve disputes between 2 individuals of the Phantom Troupe.
This was a rule Chrollo came up with. What is its significance though?
The coin flip is used to resolve disputes between 2 individuals of the Phantom Troupe.
This was a rule Chrollo came up with. What is its significance though?
The coin flip is basically a way to ask fate to decide what path to take.
If Chrollo believes in fate and predestination, the coin flip allows him to decide what fate wants him to do.
If Chrollo believes in fate and predestination, the coin flip allows him to decide what fate wants him to do.
Now, let's move into manga spoilers.
Hisoka kills both Shalnark and Kortopi, and says that he will not stop until he has killed all of the Spiders.
Hisoka kills both Shalnark and Kortopi, and says that he will not stop until he has killed all of the Spiders.
I find it incredibly appropriate for Hisoka to kill the Spiders because he knows all of them, so it is personal, and he was a false 4th member.
You can think of him as a parasite that will eat the Spider up.
You can think of him as a parasite that will eat the Spider up.
Chrollo is pissed as hell onboard the Black Whale.
This makes sense for multiple reasons.
This makes sense for multiple reasons.
I have said this before and I will say this again; the Troupe members value both identity and comradery.
Chrollo is mad as hell for 2 reasons:
1) Kortopi and Shalnark, 2 of his beloved comrades, are dead.
Chrollo is mad as hell for 2 reasons:
1) Kortopi and Shalnark, 2 of his beloved comrades, are dead.
Hisoka will continue to kill more of his comrades, and that seriously pisses him off.
Now on the second reason.
Now on the second reason.
2) Hisoka is coming for the Spider, what Chrollo's identity is tied to.
If the Spider dies, Chrollo's identity, along with the identity of all the members of the Spider, dead or alive, will be gone eternally.
If the Spider dies, Chrollo's identity, along with the identity of all the members of the Spider, dead or alive, will be gone eternally.
All of their lives will have been in vain. Their lives would have no identity or purpose, just like the pathetic state they were in when they resided in Meteor City.
He, along with the other Troupe members, CANNOT let this happen.
He, along with the other Troupe members, CANNOT let this happen.
Chrollo is in fact so mad, that he rejects the coin flip method.
He tries to justify his actions by saying that everyone wants to kill him instead of a dispute between just 2 people, but it is clear he wants to do this himself. He is rejecting the fate he has followed.
He tries to justify his actions by saying that everyone wants to kill him instead of a dispute between just 2 people, but it is clear he wants to do this himself. He is rejecting the fate he has followed.
Chrollo is a character who has an incredible design and through intentionally not showing him that much and not overtly giving away info on him, there is a strong aura and a sense of mystique around him.
However, JUST enough is given away in the form of subtle clues that come together beautifully and tell you a LOT about the type of person he is.
This is why he is my fav character, not just in HxH, but in anime :)
This is why he is my fav character, not just in HxH, but in anime :)
I hope this thread proved really useful :)
I may add some stuff in the future if it comes to mind, but I will leave it at this for now :)
I may add some stuff in the future if it comes to mind, but I will leave it at this for now :)
This would be my tier list for Troupe members on an INDIVIDUAL level, not a group level:
Chrollo, Hisoka - masterful
Nobunaga, Pakunoda, Illumi - awesome
Machi, Uvogin - great
Feitan, Phinks, Shalnark, Franklin, Shizuku, Kalluto - good
Kortopi, Bonolenov - fine
Chrollo, Hisoka - masterful
Nobunaga, Pakunoda, Illumi - awesome
Machi, Uvogin - great
Feitan, Phinks, Shalnark, Franklin, Shizuku, Kalluto - good
Kortopi, Bonolenov - fine
The Troupe are great on an individual level.
Some ppl may say, "Oh, but some Troupe members don't have much character weight. They should have been given more."
I respectfully disagree.
Some ppl may say, "Oh, but some Troupe members don't have much character weight. They should have been given more."
I respectfully disagree.
Characters should NOT be judged in a vacuum. They should be judged within the context of the narrative.
Members like Pakunoda and Nobunaga have more weight and prioritization individually, and as such, their character work is amazing.
Members like Pakunoda and Nobunaga have more weight and prioritization individually, and as such, their character work is amazing.
On the other hand, members like Bonolenov and Kortopi have very less weight and prioritization on an individual level, and as such, their character work is just eh.
They are not bad characters, but rather functional ones and that is good as they are prioritized less.
They are not bad characters, but rather functional ones and that is good as they are prioritized less.
